Proposed changes to the guidelines for the VBB going forward - comments please

Hello all,

Helen has proposed a number of changes to the guidelines for this VBB to bring it in line with other VBBs of a similar nature. I am going to list them here and would like to get your feedback on them as if most people agree we will bring them in from the next round.

Please post comments to this thread if you would like to provide some input.

Proposed changes:

* Currently, members sitting out a round have been allowed to temporarily withdraw their books from the shelf for that round. This reduces the size of the selection pool for the remaining members. The new suggestion is that those sitting out a round will need to leave their books in for selection. If they are going away and unable to post books, those selecting the books will need to wait for them to return before receiving their requested book.

* Replacements - many other VBBs require members to replace with new selections any books sitting unselected for more than two rounds (or a nominated period). While being aware of this rule, I have been hesitant to introduce it here as some members have mentioned they have been struggling to read fast enough to add new books. Also, being a 1001 books group, there may be new members in the future who haven't read the unselected books and I would prefer not to remove a choice for them. Jon has suggested that one way to get around this would be to make a new category 'unselected' or some such and change the status of these books to that category so that they don't clutter up the 'available' list but are still there for members to select from if they want to.

I am not wedded to any positions on any of these points so would love to throw it open for some discussion to all, if you have any more new suggestions from your experiences with VBBs please chip in.

Also, if there is anyone interested in being a back-up moderator for this group, please let me know. It will just mean if for any reason I can't quickly update the page, someone else could jump in.

Thanks everyone and I look forward to reading your comments,

cheers
Rachel

Hi everyone

Yes, I definitely think that books need to be replaced after a while. Otherwise in time the box ends up being full of books no-one wants to choose because we have all either read them already, or they are on our TBR shelf.

However, I do feel that replacing books after being in the box for two rounds is possibly a bit early. I'd be happy with three rounds or even four rounds.

What do others think?

Hi All,

I don't mind what the rules are, but regarding the proposed changes:-

1. makes sense to me to leave the books in. In earlier rounds I've had my eye on a particular book only to find it's been made unavailable because the member is sitting out the round.

2. replacing 'stale' books also makes sense to me. Currently there are only three books that I haven't read in the available list. Luckily there have been enough different ones added before my turn to enable me to continue to select and add books, but I think we will soon reach saturation. I suggest a five rounds in, then five rounds out, rule. ie if a book has not been selected by the end of its 5th round, it is withdrawn and replaced with another, then after another 5 rounds the original book may be offered again if it is still available. That way any new members will still have the opportunity to access the books that the older members may have already read.

Five rounds in, then five rounds out would suit me fine. Thanks for the idea, cat207.

Another issue I feel needs to be discussed is that of members leaving the box. I suggested the following to Rachel, and she asked that I post it on the forum for comment.

I have absolutely no objection to members leaving, but I feel that the manner in which they withdraw needs to be fair to all. All the other VBBs I belong to (or have belonged to in the past) require members to leave their books in the box and continue to send if requested, or replace as necessary, until they have none remaining.

We all contribute two books to the box when we join. If someone leaves with (say) five books in the available list, and those books are simply removed, then that member has obviously chosen and received three more books than they have sent out to others (because their books were not chosen). To me, this really doesn't seem fair to all the other players.

I'm in a couple of (international) VBBs over on BookObsessed that I'd really like to get out of, but I still need to keep replacing my books with new ones until I put something in that is chosen, and until I have no books at all left in the box. It's a bit of a pain, but I see the reasoning, and it's only fair to all. Otherwise I could choose half a dozen (or more) books I want and then say "sorry, gotta go"!!

In the case of this VBB, I'd be happy with a compromise in that members could leave when they have only two books left (the same number they put in at the start) rather than having to wait until they are all chosen.

-- cross posted here and on the "Departing members" thread --

I think the five rounds in five rounds out is a good idea. My concern is that lists like these tend do get clogged up with books nobody wants or has already read. Often the same books keep on popping up without being chosen. Maybe having a list posted somewhere with those books would help participants avoid offering them?

It's a good idea to have the policy that people have to keep replacing books until they are chosen, but I think it's ok if people leave with still two books on offer. There is really no way to police that though and often people leave because there is too much happening in their lives at that point, so I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Jon

Appreciate your thoughts, crimson-tide.

The only reason I'm withdrawing (temporarily -maybe for the rest of this year) is because we're moving. We are currently building a house but whilst it's being built we're moving in with my in-laws. All of our stuff will have to go into storage and I'm trying to minimise things to put into storage. I'd like to get back into VBB when we're settled into our new place (probably with 'new' books as I'd like to not store what I have now).

So far, I've received 2 books and sent out 1. I'm more than happy, at the end of this round, to send out to anyone any books I've put into the box. At the moment, these are the books in the box from me:

The White Tiger
The Woodlanders
Vanity Fair
Memoirs of a Geisha

The first book I've received and ready to go back in the box is A Town Like Alice. The second book I've received (but not read and will therefore kept til I'm back in) is the African Trilogy.

-- cross posted to 'Departing Members' thread --

Yes, I understand there's a host of reasons people leave boxes, or don't send books, or whatever. That's life. Nothing is enforceable and I'm not in any way attempting or meaning to sound like we need to pull out a big stick... ;-) Was only speaking in principle.

And of course the theory and system gets totally confusing when generous folk (like running-gal, but I'm sure there are others too) put into the box more books that they actually choose and take out.

I myself will also be away from my "book stash" for at least four months from the middle of this month. I figure that this round will be done by the time I go. The August round won't be too much before I return, so that only leaves the June round. I'm still happy to keep playing, with the proviso that if anyone chooses one of my books in June I may not have it with me (so they may need to wait two or three months before I send it). Not the end of the world, and it will definitely be sent. But then again I do need to take some books with me, so I may just have them...

I agree that two rounds is too quick and I am happy to go with the five - I usually would like to read more of the books on the list but I don't pick too many as I am always behind with reading, so it would be nice to see them back again to be chosen, the next time.

I initially got confused with the lists of what was available and what was not, but I have now learned to adjust the tags in the top left hand corner when looking at the books.... so it is all quite straight forward.

Helen has some valid points about members departing and yes, to be fair, it should be all evened out before anyone leaves.

I've really enjoyed being able to choose from this VBB as it is forcing me to tackle the 1001 list.

Thank you to everyone for sharing and to running-gal for organising it all.

For what it's worth, I think that if you have had a book sitting on the list for a “long time” and you wish to replace them, then that should be fine. I'm not overly in favour of prescribing when a book becomes "stale", as each person's own personal situation would be different, but am happy to go along with the group consensus.

As for making books unavailable if you aren’t participating in a particular round then I think it depends on why you aren’t participating. If it is simply because you have no time to read any new books, then you might choose to still participate by leaving your books available for selection. If, however, it’s because you yourself are going to be unavailable for an extended period – overseas holidays, illness, etc. – then temporarily having your books withdrawn may be a better option.

Another factor to consider is that it would be less work for Rachel/running-gal if the default position was for the books to remain available when you are sitting out a round.

In my case I'm unable to participate again this month, and almost certainly again in May. I’d say I was happy to have my books left as available, but I'm scheduled for surgery on 22 April and if I receive any requests from mid-to-late next week I don’t know when I’d be able to forward them on. Depending on the outcome I'm likely to be having a third round of surgery in early/mid-May too, so it's possible I may not be able to participate again or forward on any books until June.