Will the Bernie people stay in the Democratic Party and move it leftward?

If the November elections prove a debacle for the republicans, will the Bernie People stay involved in the Democrats and move the party in a leftward more traditionally Democratic direction or will the Dems stay a large middle party groping for a middle class that doesn't really exist under globalization?

To the first part, shall he "stay involved with the Democrats"-- he has no alternative to that since he's an independent who is practically the sole Senator to the Left of a right-wing Democratic party pretending to be the opposition to an even more extreme right-wing Republican party.

To the second -- ..."and move the party in a leftward more traditionally Democratic direction or will the Dems stay a large middle party groping for a middle class...
"

The whole point of Clinton's candidacy is to ensure that the Democratic party _not_ move leftward, to ensure that it remains the captive of neo-con ideology exemplified by Obama's two terms as a fake Democrat.

Of course he won't move the party leftward. He's not prepared to make the necessary sacrifices to do that even if he could and even if it were possible.

Bernie is quite prepared to move the Democrats to the left. He's been thinking about how to do that for the last twenty years. His difficulty is how to create a movement that will last more than a single four year period. The usual way to do that is somehow providing a martyr which can be invoked in future struggles with the rightist and centrist parts of the Democrats. Being dead is a step few politicians can view as a tactic. A usable myth needs to be constructed to make the Bernyites a cult, rather than a romance. Perhaps, given the age of Bernie...he'll die in the next two years, not deliberately, but the man cannot remove that as a factor. Elizabeth Warren has the credentials to take over the position of gadfly. Unlike the Bernyites that can't vote for Trump...there are Trump votes that may lie open to the Berners once the Trump bubble bursts...ageing white males may want to make a mark before they are gone with the wind, and Dudonald will disappoint....massively.
The USA does so badly need a New Deal, and one on the line of FDR, run by Elizabeth Warren could unseat a second term attempt by Hillary...so that's an optimistic outcome.
Or the Trumpettes could morph into a more obviously fascist party...and find the backing that Ford and Linbergh tried to utilize with their "America First" movement. Interesting but scary for the neighbours.

The many suspicious suicides surrounding Hillary Rodham Clinton

12.08.2016

by Guy Somerset

It is an unfortunate fact of life if one lives long enough a certain number of tragedies will touch upon his existence. Children will be injured. Family members may become sick. Friends might die. These are the lamentable but unexceptional sorrows which befall us all in some uncertain measure.

During an allotted amount of decades a human being can expect companions, both close intimates and casual acquaintances, to be lost to any variety of factors including illness, calamity and even suicide.

Of all these perhaps the last, self-immolation, is the most shocking because it is frequently the least expected. Yet mercifully in the course of a human timespan the quantity of suicides one encounters is more or less insignificant by comparison with the sum of our total associates.

Generally speaking an ordinary individual will have personal connections to approximately one or two suicides over the course of many decades. Add to this a possibility of being tangentially linked, as in a friend of a friend or coworker, to an additional two or three; again over the course of multiple decades.

Certainly there are outliers: the privileged soul who never encounters such a misfortune as well as the regrettable body who may glimpse the suffering of five or six such desperate personalities. Still these are the exceptions through the course of a ninety or hundred year existence. For most the maximum allotment of experience with those who take their own lives will be only two or three.

However what should we make of a woman who in less than seventy years on this planet has had particular relations with five, ten or as many as fifteen people who committed suicide? Would we question whether there might be some explanation behind this startling high amount? Indeed, would it be incorrect to consider such a woman anything less than the Typhoid Mary of suicidal epidemics?

...

http://www.pravdareport.com/world/americas/12-08-2016/135307-hillary_clinton_sui...

If Clinton is "Typhoid Mary", what are you, Phlegethon99?

This is what happens when a country has been handed over to Satanists, Jews, muslims, bleeding-heart liberals, faggots and freemasons.

http://www.librarything.com/topic/227646#5678422

>3 DinadansFriend:

Bernie is quite prepared to move the Democrats to the left. He's been thinking about how to do that for the last twenty years.

Nonsense. He's only been a Democrat since he decided to run for president. Until now, he has never been elected to any office as a Democrat; indeed, he has never before run for office as a Democrat.

If he really wanted to move the party to the left, he'd have joined the party, rather than just caucusing with it in the Senate.

>5 LolaWalser: It makes Phlegethon99 un-American.

>6 lilithcat::
Any person of a left-wing bent has always thought about the Democrats becoming a real left-wing party, and has been disappointed in their relentless clinging to the centrist point of view since FDR. Bernie, as an Independent Socialist could not have escaped this constant meme in left-wing thought. Once you join a party, you do so in an effort to influence it. He did rather well, when he did and has effected some useful changes in the platform. I believe the definition of my comment as "nonsense", reveals the depth of your research of the question, or the serious lack of American research on what a more left-wing party could do for the ordinary American.

>4 Phlegethon99::
Before describing HRC as a kind of Angel of Death" one should perhaps obtain statistics on the number and percentage of political figures and operatives who commit suicide in the "Normal" course of events. It is a high pressure occupation, I understand. If I were cherry picking suicides from history, let us consider the number of Julius Caesar's political contemporaries who killed themselves, not to mention Adolf Hitler's, or the Emperor Hirohito.

Different times and different code of honour. Most Americans have no honour at all.

If you look into Hillary's cold dead eyes you see evil incarnate. By embracing Hillary Bernie did not just surrender, he joined the dark side. You can become guilty not just by your deeds but also by ignoring the dirty deeds of others and looking away.

Face it: The U.S.A. are doomed. Western Europe is doomed. Australia and New Zealand as well as Canada and the better parts of South America are being taken over by Asia and are thus ultimately doomed as well. Eastern Europe also will succumb where it is run by corrupt autocephalic Orthodoxy.

"We are born into this time and must bravely follow the path to the destined end. There is no other way. Our duty is to hold on to the lost position, without hope, without rescue, like that Roman soldier whose bones were found in front of a door in Pompeii, who, during the eruption of Vesuvius, died at his post because they forgot to relieve him. That is greatness. That is what it means to be a thoroughbred. The honorable end is the one thing that can not be taken from a man."
― Oswald Spengler, Man and Technics: A Contribution to a Philosophy of Life

"A culture which consistently refuses to assume God as its highest law and goal will in the end assume him as its judgment and end. Cultures that have become unviable do not die a natural death - they get strangled."
― Gertrud von le Fort

>10 Phlegethon99::
Ah, Spengler, the man who wrote "Optimism is Cowardice!" I hold with Toynbee, whose book is of the opinion that while our western Christian Civilization is tending towards a Universal State and then a collapse, to be succeeded then by another generation of civilization, has yet the capacity, since we live in an age where the entire planet is at last involved in the preservation of civilization, of evolving a world-wide civilization at last. Optimism, to me, is the natural state of the healthy mind, and culture.
Spengler and Celine the novelist are instead the prophets who counsel the rest of us to draw our cloaks over our heads and await the killer's stroke.
I am too old for romantic fatalism. I want to get up tomorrow Mr. Spengler, and I will!

Senator Sanders, and his supporters, are NOT going to move the Democrats in any direction. HRC is a canny politician (whatever else can be said about her); she knows that the key to victory is to swing as far right as she can to attract the less loony Trump supporters. After all, how many Bernie supporters are going to actually vote for Trump? As long as the current strategies are winning elections, nothing will change. And even if HRC's tried and true tactics fail to win the election...welll, we won't know that until November, now will we?

>12 BruceCoulson::
Nope, Hillary and company, aware of her considerable help from the Berners, who wouldn't vote for Trump and outnumber the republican fleerats, and aware that she owes defectors from the Trumpeting NOTHING should not concede them an inch. They are fleeing to her, for are they threatening to go back to the Republicans at this stage? No. The drive at this point is to make as many Democrats as possible in order to regain control of the Senate, House and the Supreme court. The last eight years of legislative deadlock haven't endeared the republicans to the general election populace.
Facing the massive climate shifts with even worse to come, the USA has to abandon the Climate change denying party, the slaves of the one percent! I think the attitude in the rest of the country is rather different than the view from the Arizona retirement haven.

>10 Phlegethon99::
I found this poem for the prophets of doom, just to remind them that things have seemed bleak before. "

Waiting for the Barbarians by C. P. Cavafy (trans. by Rae Dalven, edited by Richard Fietz)

What are we waiting for, assembled in the Public Square?
The Barbarians are to arrive today.
Why such inaction in the Senate?
Why do the Senators sit and pass no laws?
.....
When the Barbarians come they will make the laws.
......
.... night is here, but the barbarians have not come.
Some people arrived from the frontiers,
and they said there are no longer any barbarians.

And now what shall become of us without any barbarians?
Those people were a kind of solution.

Cavafy wrote that poem in Greece, before 1911. Since then, optimism has been a better guide than despair. the best antidote to despair is positive action, get up, go outside, walk into the sunlight, and retrieve a child's ball, or anything...

>10 Phlegethon99::
And while we are at it, what's the big thing against the Freemasons? I thought they were somewhat pretentious for a social club, but what else?

As an old-school Catholic I consider freemasonry an Anglo-American, and thus alien, Satanic heresy. Same with other modern cults like Wicca, Scientology, Mormonism, dispensationalism.

Regarding Spengler and your hope to live another day I 'll stick with St. Athanasius:

"For man's whole life is short when measured against the time to come, so short, in fact, that it is as nothing in comparison with eternity. . . . Therefore, my children, let us persevere in our acts of asceticism. And that we may not become weary and disheartened, it is good to meditate on the words of the apostle: 'I die daily.' If we live with the picture of death always before our eyes, we will not sin. The apostle's words tell us that we should so awaken in the morning as though we would not live to evening, and so fall asleep as if there were to be no awakening. For our life is by nature uncertain and is daily meted out to us by Providence. If we are convinced of this and live each day as the apostle suggests, then we will not fall into sin; no desire will enslave us, no anger move us, no treasure bind us to earth; we will await death with unfettered hearts."

Hmm, by the same logic you could live each day to the max carpe diem and all that.

I'm coming in with the Lakotah Sioux} saying "Hoka Haye!" (It is a good day to die!) Though not inspiration for procrastinators it does cover the same ground...minus the asceticism. Asceticism, by the way is not a large part of Jesus actual teachings, but seems to have been a large part of formal religions everywhere.
Ascetism seems to stem for Christians from the Apostle who never met Jesus, Paul, and his Epistle to the Corinthians, who may have been comfortably living folk.
By the way I did not say "I hope to live another day", I said to "Get up in the morning", that is to start a day, no matter what its outcome.